Counterattack: Big Four in EPL, Who Else?

Shane Evans: The English Premier League. It's not just the premier football league in England, but in the world, and the teams are far too good to be defined by only four teams. Things are changing and it may not be this year but that group will be broken up, mark my words.

Allen Ramsey: I disagree. The Big Four have everything they need to continue dominating the league. They all have young stars, bright coaches, money to buy more stars, and large international fan bases that will continue to fund their enterprises. I just can't see any of the other teams in England making consistent forays into the top four.

Evans: I see what you're saying, but there is so much quality in the league, that the other teams are competing. Everton may not have the worldwide fan base, but they have the majority of Merseyside. Aston Villa has practically the entire city of Birmingham and no less than five players who will be making regular England appearances over the next five years. So on a talent level, they can be matched.

Ramsey: True, especially when you talk about Villa and Everton’s talent levels and local support, but let’s not begin to think that having a load of England's best players in your team will be enough to win in the EPL. Sure, having the country's top players can be an advantage, but the Premier League is now an international showcase league. The ability to sign top internationals is more important these days than developing your own youngsters. Plus, in the case of Villa, do you really think they'll be able to hold onto Gabby Agbonlahor and Ashley Young when the big boys offer huge money for them? I don't.

Evans: I never said winning the Premier League title, I was referring more to challenging for it, and at least grabbing that Champions League spot. The mold that the Big Four have created over the last five to ten years is going to be broken. Just look at what Blackburn did when they won the Premier League. They did it with hard-working players who combined well together, and weren't necessarily the highest-valued, with the exception of Alan Shearer, of course. They just fit with each other. That's the type of attitude and spirit the likes of Martin O'Neill and David Moyes and Mark Hughes are trying to achieve. Well, maybe not Mark Hughes now, but Mark Hughes four months ago.

Ramsey: Good point. I don't deny that eventually one of the "other" teams will slip into a Champions League spot. You're probably right about that. But I can't see Villa, Everton, or any other EPL side taking one of the four CL spots and making it their own over a span of three or four years. Right now Arsenal is the most vulnerable of the Big Four, but they're set for the future with Wenger's youth movement. Liverpool also have some of the best young players in the EPL and look set for at least the next three or four years - or at least until Steven Gerrard is gone. United may have the best core of young players in the league with the likes of Nani, Rafael and Anderson waiting in the wings for the older stars to retire. And they can always sign more. Maybe Chelsea falters for a year or two when they lose their aging group of stars, but even then, I don't see any other team that will be ready to step in and take their spot in the top four.

Attitude and spirit only go so far. At some point the cream still rises to the top.

Evans: So then you bring in this Manchester City element. They maybe won't make a Big Four spot their own. They are going to make it a Big Five. With the money they are talking about throwing around, they could easily hold down one of the top two or three spots year after year, if they do it right. The other teams, your Villas, Evertons and Tottenhams are going in the right direction, and regardless will have money to spend. They just have to be wiser with it, and so far have done it well.

Ramsey: The “Big Five” is a possibility with City having so much money to spend, but I still have some questions about their spending. Jo is a prime example of money gone wrong. The Big Four may all make bad signings (Robbie Keane), but more often than not they get it right (Fernando Torres). The other problem here is that great players want to play in the Champions League. I can't see Kaka, Ribery, Messi, or Benzema leaving teams that will be in the Champions League next year to join a team that won't. It's a catch-22. Hard to sign great players if you’re not in the Champions League, hard to get in the Champions League without signing great players. All of the teams you mention will likely have to make their first run to the top four with players that they discovered or developed rather than established superstars. Robihno (a well established superstar), I think, will prove to be more the exception than the rule at Man City.

Evans: Well the thing with Man City is simple: Money talks. No matter who you are, if you see a team start buying players at an alarming rate and throwing huge weekly salaries at them, Champions League or not, you're going to think about joining up. The rest of the teams I'm arguing for you really just have to look at how well they players work together. They don't need to be Kaka or Messi or Ronaldo thrown together in one midfield, because I don't think that'd ever work. They need to fit as a unit and Martin O'Neill can do that extremely well. Coaching is a huge part of winning in the EPL, and having coachable players and not disagreeable superstars, makes all the difference

Counterattack runs every Thursday.